Michigan vs. FSU, Orange Bowl, 8pm, ESPN, Game Day - Post Game Discussion

[iam416]

Yet OSU will find ways to run the ball, largely due to actually being able to properly use Samuel, as well as having a mobile QB. OSU rushed for over 200 yards on Michigan this year despite it being a "down" year for the OSU offensive line. I'll bet that they get there against Clemson too.

They'll find ways to run the ball, but JTB is going to be running for his life like Speight was last night. Wilkins and Lawrence are real deal 1st rounders.

But, to your point, the 3 losses, while all close, weren't a good show for the offense. They ought to raise questions that can't merely be pinned on Hoke.

The defense is awesome. That was, perhaps, the most surprising part of the game. The busted coverage and the 71-yard run on 3rd and 22. Those, man, I just wouldn't expect. I can handle getting outschemed -- once -- to get McCray on Cook. I could handle Cook breaking a long one on a normal running down. I can even handle a fluky kick return. Those other two plays, though. Not good.

[CGVT]

Relax.

Michigan got beat because they didn't have as much talent as FSU. They made the coaching adjustments at halftime to win the game but couldn't quite pull it off because they didn't have the horses. Playing an entire game in which you expect to have your best defensive player but don't, and losing your best offensive player for the second half was probably the difference.

Just be glad they didn't "get' to play Alabama.

[Hannibal]

I'm not in the flush everything camp. It's too easy to generate massive failure of a system and coaches when it's obvious where the biggest problem is for M. Improve OL recruiting and development and Harbauffense is fine.

This is precisely what I mean when I talk about the normalization and acceptance of failure. Our O-line recruits last night, from left to right, went

high 3*
high 4*
4*
5*
4*

Recruiting wasn't the problem..

[paul daugherity]

It's a mix. There are some talent issues, but also some coaching issues. Hopefully Harbaugh assesses and diagnoses it in the offseason and makes the needed changes.

[CGVT]

You can put all the numbers and stars on it that you want but there is a talent disparity.

And I don't care what kind of wash it was. Going for two at the end of the third quarter is stupid

[Hannibal]

It's a mix. There are some talent issues, but also some coaching issues.

It's more of the latter. We did have one freshman out there, but we also had three fifth year seniors and a fourth year junior. There was not a single guy playing who was a scrub recruit. Even Braden had MSU and Wisconsin offers coming out of high school.

Louisville scored 63 points on the defense that brutally assraped us at the LOS last night. Do they have more talent? Better recruits?

[Hannibal]

The big plays are another interesting issue. Has anyone ever noticed that it is always us giving up the one or two blown coverages or big plays each game? Has anyone noticed that our offense never does this against a good defense? Ever?

Blown coverages are a part of scheme -- the defense either getting confused or not having time to get set up properly. This is why we never benefit from them unless we are playing Rutgers or Maryland.

[WM Wolverine]

Bredeson was out of his league against FSU. He's a frosh. That's semi-understandable. Kalis was good against crap and overmatched against good. I think it's hard to get really good OL play when you have 1 clear weak link and when you have 2, and they're both interior, well, I don't know what to say. When you run into really good DTs -- which they have in spades on the southern elite teams -- you get gutted from inside. They papered over it enough against OSU b/c OSU doesn't have great DTs -- but against the likes of FSU, Clemson or, heaven forbid, Alabama, they have no chance.
__________________

This! Dominant defensive lineman tore us apart, we had 'experienced' but mediocre offensive line talent that did just good enough when they weren't facing NFL talent... M's own defensive line did the same against a ton of average or worse offensive lines all season.

[iam416]

Yeah, even the kids from Colorado and Iowa gave M fits on the interior. You step up to actual future Pro Bowlers and, well, you run into problems.

It's a damn shame stud DTs apparently mostly only hail from the South. And it's a damn shame Wilkins went south. At least you guys have Gary, but I'm not sure he's better than Lawrence -- Clemson Lawrence, not LSU Lawrence.

[WM Wolverine]

FSU's NFL-ready DL were in our backfield all night, it was a huge mismatch and decided the game just like it decided the Iowa game. M's OL is far-and-away the thing that held them back this season.

The 4-5 big plays were nearly FSU's offensive scoring, for the most part they were mistakes M hasn't made all season.

[iam416]

Yep. M's DL is right there with anyone. They pretty much owned the LoS. However, when they just drew or slightly lost, Cook really made them pay.

[Hannibal]

...accepting excuses and normalizing failure. Exactly like the basketball program.

[Cody_Russell]

Hmm, Louisville's o-line must consist of five 1st Rounders when they put up 63 points on FSU. OR Josh Sweat, the only d-lineman to not play at Louisville, is that good...
OR scheme.

When FSU played man coverage, it looked like Darboh and Cheeson didn't get open. I hope DPJ is a difference maker from 2017-2019.

[WM Wolverine]

Understanding cause...

The talent from college football is coming from the south, southeast. Best talent on the offensive and defensive lines aren't growing up in our backyard or even in the midwest; it's all the way across the country and you're recruiting against everyone to land those type of players...

Take a look at the top 50 overall DL and OL from the last few recruiting cycles... They are going to Ohio State and the south as they are mostly all from the south. Odds are stacked against us in these recruiting battles to land All American talent. There aren't near enough Onwenu's, Bredeson's & Gary's (all '16) in the B1G footprint.

[Whitley]

Understanding cause...

The talent from college football is coming from the south, southeast. Best talent on the offensive and defensive lines aren't growing up in our backyard or even in the midwest; it's all the way across the country and you're recruiting against everyone to land those type of players...

Take a look at the top 50 overall DL and OL from the last few recruiting cycles... They are going to Ohio State and the south as they are mostly all from the south. Odds are stacked against us in these recruiting battles to land All American talent. There aren't near enough Onwenu's, Bredeson's & Gary's (all '16) in the B1G footprint.

That would seem to imply that the Big Ten should look to expand farther south so they can more of an opportunity to go after those types of talent (and for the population expansion happening there).

If the Big Ten expanded into say Virginia, North Carolina and Georgia (UVA, NC, Duke and GT) how big a difference would that make in the long term?