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Old Yesterday, 11:24 AM   #35561
Rocky Bleier
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This all began in 1988 with a kid copying the character in a Stephen King novel called Rage. We have a people problem. Guns have been around for centuries, but this craziness is a reflection of our culture. You can't pass a law that keeps a kid from stealing his dad's gun and killing people. You can't pass a law that prevents a kid from driving a car at high-speed into a crowd of students. I told people advocating a ban on AR-15 platform rifles after the last school shooting in Florida that it could have been done with a revolver and a shotgun. I was told that I was stupid.

Seems that most of these killer were bullied and outcast. Some of them are narcissistic. More gun laws won't change anything. A gun is a tool that is no better or worse than the person using it.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rage_(King_novel)
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Old Yesterday, 11:36 AM   #35562
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Quote:
I told people advocating a ban on AR-15 platform rifles after the last school shooting in Florida that it could have been done with a revolver and a shotgun. I was told that I was stupid
Yeah, they have nothing to say after Texas other than to mock folks who offer "thoughts and prayers." The guns were staple firearms. The shooter was underage and thus it was illegal for him to acquire the guns and, more importantly, there was no background check because, well, it was illegal for him to buy guns. And Texas has a law about securing firearms.

There was literally nothing that could be done other than banning and confiscating ALL guns. So, anyone using the Texas tragedy as a reason to "do something" is essentially advocating the complete ban and confiscation of guns -- as that's the only "something" that could have worked.
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Old Yesterday, 12:08 PM   #35563
Rocky Bleier
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What bothers me is being told that I don't care about kids, and that I care more about guns than children. I want to focus on the real problem, though I don't know if we can turn back the clock on our culture. Yes, make schools safer, but other buildings will be just as vulnerable. What if a sizable group of kids hang out at a local eatery? Trucks are a popular choice of weapon in Europe for the jihadis. Anyone who says guns are the problem is offering up a simplistic solution that won't prevent future attacks. They're the type of people who want the government to take care of them and all of their problems. It opens the door to tyrants, which is exactly what the 2nd Amendment was designed to prevent. Ban guns and we'll be like London, where they now have such a problem with wayward knives running the streets that the mayor wants them to be banned too.
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Old Yesterday, 12:14 PM   #35564
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Not only knives and trucks, they dont have the right to free speech anymore in the UK. You can be jailed for a joke, or telling the truth about Islam. And with the way that some want to legislate language here and do away with the first amendment while they're at it, if people dont think tyranny is right around the corner they're not paying attention. We are becoming a post constitutional nation.
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Old Yesterday, 01:48 PM   #35565
millenwasmyfavorite
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocky Bleier View Post
What bothers me is being told that I don't care about kids, and that I care more about guns than children. I want to focus on the real problem, though I don't know if we can turn back the clock on our culture. Yes, make schools safer, but other buildings will be just as vulnerable. What if a sizable group of kids hang out at a local eatery? Trucks are a popular choice of weapon in Europe for the jihadis. Anyone who says guns are the problem is offering up a simplistic solution that won't prevent future attacks. They're the type of people who want the government to take care of them and all of their problems. It opens the door to tyrants, which is exactly what the 2nd Amendment was designed to prevent. Ban guns and we'll be like London, where they now have such a problem with wayward knives running the streets that the mayor wants them to be banned too.
This.

Pretty much lost in translation on all fronts -- but, touched upon by article Jeff linked:

Soft targets are in abundance -- and all executable through improvised or conventional weapons.

If not schools, then hospitals. If not hospitals, then churches. If not churches, then shopping centers/grocery stores/high trafficked civic centers.

The footpath to tyranny is open both ways.
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Old Yesterday, 01:58 PM   #35566
Rocky Bleier
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Three gunmen just opened fire this evening on a crowd With Kalashnikovs in Marseille, France. France has very strict gun laws. They should deal with the real problem of Islamic terrorism instead of passing more ineffective laws that leave their citizens as easy targets. I wonder if the French celebrities will blame the NRA?
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Old Yesterday, 02:03 PM   #35567
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Let's get something straight here ......

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

Look, the government, at all levels, has a role in insuring "domestic tranquility' and I read that to mean some means of enforcing laws and ordinances by and for the people. So, while you may quibble with what this part of the preamble actually means, all of that quibbling is doing nothing more than advancing straw man arguments.

The right of center, actually the pretty far right of center, position is that you start talking about taking my guns and you're talking about control. Government control is unacceptable. End of argument.

The government doesn't have to take your guns, and I have certainly modified my position on that based on factual arguments presented here, to provide for some level of safety for its citizenry. I'm convinced any further gun legislation is simply not going to improve safety for the citizenry.

I've mentioned some steps that could be taken to do that that does not involve any further gun legislation. talent has said he has some that might vary from mine and I'd like to know what those are.

There are meaningful ways to contribute to this discussion but, for the most part, all I see here is the typical polarization that results in such characterizations that you are a "piece of shit gun owner" (Oracle to me), a "soy boy," an unprincipled person who hates kids and on and on.

Sad, really. With the exception of Wiz, this is a very smart group. Post like it.
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Old Yesterday, 03:04 PM   #35568
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i was going to post a long reply but decided against it. neither camp will give in.

and if you think that those on the left are calling for sensible gun control measures, listen to them make the reference that we should do what Australia did. that's there idea of sensible gun legislation... a forced government buyback program.
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Old Yesterday, 03:38 PM   #35569
crashcourse
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this dude says it right

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/pol...208049249.html
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Old Yesterday, 04:27 PM   #35570
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iam416 View Post
Yeah, they have nothing to say after Texas other than to mock folks who offer "thoughts and prayers." The guns were staple firearms. The shooter was underage and thus it was illegal for him to acquire the guns and, more importantly, there was no background check because, well, it was illegal for him to buy guns. And Texas has a law about securing firearms.

There was literally nothing that could be done other than banning and confiscating ALL guns. So, anyone using the Texas tragedy as a reason to "do something" is essentially advocating the complete ban and confiscation of guns -- as that's the only "something" that could have worked.

that is ultimately the something people want... maybe its time. American's no longer have the capability to disagree. Parents have done such a shitty job since the baby boomers had kids that we have to protect society from itself...

in fact, our culture is so echo chambered that I'm not sure we'd even make great pets.
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Old Yesterday, 05:42 PM   #35571
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Pretty significant AP investigation here

Former RNC Finance Chair Elliott Broidy and George Nader were paid millions of dollars by the Saudi and UAE governments to conduct anti-Qatar lobbying in DC. They were hoping to end up with a billion dollar defense contract at the end of it all. The AP interviewed over two dozen people for this article and obtained hundreds of pages of documents and leaked emails between Broidy and Nader.

These guys nearly succeeded. They received an initial down payment of $36 M in January 2018 as part of the $1 Billion deal. But then Nader was detained by Mueller in late January as he entered the country. Broidy's emails (that may have been hacked) began appearing in news outlets. Then in April, Broidy was revealed to have been one of Cohen's few (3) clients. Broidy paid a Playboy Playmate (who had aborted Broidy's lovechild) $1.6M through Cohen. The deal with Saudi Arabia/UAE fell apart.

One of the best chestnuts is this quote from George Nader on Jared Kushner and the administration's ME Peace Plan:

"You have to hear in private my Brother what Principals think of 'Clown prince's' efforts and his plan!" Nader wrote. "Nobody would even waste cup of coffee on him if it wasn't for who he is married to."

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/whi...win-1b-n876206
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Old Yesterday, 05:56 PM   #35572
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Remember that fertilizer plant that exploded in Texas 5 years ago? The one that killed 15 firefighters?

Pruitt and the EPA are rolling back most of the regulations that were enacted as a result of that explosion, saying they are burdensome and frivolous.

Says the Mayor of the town that was destroyed by the explosion:

“With all due respect to Scott Pruitt, he’s never lost 15 firefighter friends,” Muska told the American-Statesman. “I’m as pro-business as anyone, but some things are way, way, way more important than too much regulation, and that includes the safety of these chemical plants.”

https://www.mystatesman.com/news/sta...04AG3cAlZk17L/
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Old Yesterday, 07:42 PM   #35573
hodgkal
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A famous bumper sticker:

MY DOG, YES

MY WIFE, MAYBE

MY GUN, NEVER!!
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Old Yesterday, 07:43 PM   #35574
Dr. Strangelove
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'Member when using an unsecure server was enough reason to LOCK HER UP?

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...hackers-601903
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Old Yesterday, 08:03 PM   #35575
Kapture1
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Originally Posted by Dr. Strangelove View Post
'Member when using an unsecure server was enough reason to LOCK HER UP?

https://www.politico.com/story/2018/...hackers-601903
Yes, tweeting on a public platform is the same as mishandling classified emails

Last edited by Kapture1; Yesterday at 10:34 PM.
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Old Yesterday, 10:53 PM   #35576
millenwasmyfavorite
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Yes, tweeting on a public platform is the same as mishandling classified emails
You misunderstand the security risk here.

Do you have a security clearance? Or ever possessed one?
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Old Today, 04:21 AM   #35577
Ghengis Jon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hodgkal View Post
A famous bumper sticker:

MY DOG, YES

MY WIFE, MAYBE

MY GUN, NEVER!!

Welcome back, Doc!

I remember that sticker (from long ago...) and took a completely different message from it. A person willing to give up their dog is a person not worth knowing.
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