Michigan Football, Team 138, 2017 Season.

[Jeff Buchanan]

What exactly does "torches and pitchforks" in this instance mean? I haven't heard anyone say, write, etc., that Harbaugh should be fired. I have heard and seen people question what he is doing, question what the staff is doing, and wanting some answers from him, which I think is fair. It is getting a little much blaming the current problems on the players (or lack thereof) and the previous coaching staff. Other teams with "lesser talent" are doing more, so I think it is very fair to question Harbaugh and what exactly he's doing.

I agree. I'm fine with rational criticism but there has to be substance to it and recognition that for the most part and from the outside fans don't know shit. I've already said, I, and I speak only for myself, dislike hot takes and feelings ball.

For example, I think the criticism I've seen on the web involving the approach that the coaching staff took for O'Korn - having him take deeper drops to survey and let the play develop, while keeping TEs and RBs in max-protect, obviating these players as outlet receivers - was a poor approach. That probably came from Drevno and Hamilton but we don't know for sure.

But claiming Drevno and Pep suck and should be fired at the end of the season without providing any substance as to why that should happen is useless tripe.

[Jeff Buchanan]

My personal opinion, not that anyone cares, is that there are coaching failures this season ranging from minor to substantial. I include in these failures recruiting misses because those are absolutely on the HC. There are, of course, other causes. And, of course, they are 5-2 soon to be 8-2, so it's not a disaster. However, I don't think anyone in their right mind thinks HARBAUGH!!! hasn't had some missteps this season.

If it matters, I agree with this.

What I'm most interested in is how HARBAUGH!!!! moves forward both this year and next. Are the failures temporary and he's able to redress them? Are they more systemic and require actual change?

After Ohio State somehow beat The Nick, he invited Herman down to Tuscaloosa for a few day to talk about what OSU did to UAT. I think that was the last year UAT ran a pure power manball offense. They still aren't spready, but I doubt they'll ever have another QB that isn't a running threat.

I actually think we might see something similar at M that we saw with the approach Saban took with Jalen Hurts. If you look at Harbaugh's QB preferences after Stanford and with the 49'ers he chose Kapernick over Smith. Kapernick isn't a dual threat guy. He's a pro-style QB with athleticism. That describes Milton to a tee. I think both Peters and McCaffrey fit that bill too although to a lesser degree than Milton.

[hack]

1. Great OL post by Jeff. Exactly.

2. Froot with a smart counter to it.

3. Good post by talent.

4. Hack's Takes Matter

[froot loops]

One more point about Brian Cook, had Hoke been taken to the woodshed like that, it would have been confirming every nasty thing he said about Hoke.

[iam416]

Jeff:

I definitely like Milton and think that's a good move for M. I also thought McCaffrey was athletic enough to run some.

In any event, I filly expect HARBAUGH!!! to correct the major problems. I don't think this season portends much.

[Jeff Buchanan]

Jeff:

I definitely like Milton and think that's a good move for M. I also thought McCaffrey was athletic enough to run some.

In any event, I filly expect HARBAUGH!!! to correct the major problems. I don't think this season portends much.

If I were to give any credit to the vocal complainers it would be to the ones that fault Harbaugh for notching but one victory over M's rivals, a hapless MSU team in 2016, after 5 tries. Personally, I think there are mitigating factors in 2 of his 4 losses but I'm not here to rehash those.

I also think Harbaugh is going to get things right. The extended length of time to do that, compared to those coaches he is being compared with, is precipitated by a number of circumstances to include missteps he is responsible for along with things he has no control over.

In private, I think JH would admit to and accept responsibility for his missteps.

[WingsFan]

The reason I completely went 'off' on the screw-job last year (besides the obvious reasons) is I knew this year would be down and you don't get chances like that very often, win and your in. Just like when the 2013 Red Wings had the Blackhawks down 1-3 - I knew it would be the only chance to be in that position for many year (if ever again in my lifetime) and they blew it.

[hack]

I think the sort-of slow start is his own fault. Luck aside.

[hack]

The reason I completely went 'off' on the screw-job last year (besides the obvious reasons) is I knew this year would be down and you don't get chances like that very often, win and your in. Just like when the 2013 Red Wings had the Blackhawks down 1-3 - I knew it would be the only chance to be in that position for many year (if ever again in my lifetime) and they blew it.

Yup. Makeup calls this year won't make up for it

[WingsFan]

exactly, and as I said before - Ill believe that when I see it

[CGVT]

It was best that they didn't get in. They didn't belong.

[froot loops]

If you win a Big Ten championship, it is nothing to sneeze at. You can't ever guarantee you will ever feel like you are worthy. Even worthy teams get taken to the woodshed by Bama. They had ton of pro talent on that team.

Harbaugh has put up a big target, the John L Smith-like antics dominates the headlines but amplifies the criticism when you lose.

[Jeff Buchanan]

I spoke of this circumstance up thread here. It's pertinent to the current discussion about the propriety of leveling criticism at Jim Harbaugh.

The article linked to below notes that M has never really been in the company of perennial NC contenders. Much of this has to do with, what the author describes as a geographical disadvantage in recruiting. Thus, expectations for Harbaugh to immediately compete among these NC contenders may be unrealistic.

He goes on to conclude that if Harbaugh fails to reach the play-offs and play for an NC as HC at M it's going to say more about Michigan than it says about Harbaugh

While I think there is some practicality to this view, I think Harbaugh himself would dismiss it as silly.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/college/columnist/dan-wolken/2017/10/24/jim-harbaugh-michigan-college-football-playoff/795746001/

[froot loops]

That author probably has it right in regards to being a perennial contender for a national championship. Those kind of programs are rare, he loses it a little when he talks of a playoff appearance and national championship, win the Big Ten and most years you are in the playoffs. If they don't win a Big Ten title that says more about Harbaugh than Michigan.

[Hannibal]

If they don't win a Big Ten title that says more about Harbaugh than Michigan.

This.