MSU thread (in the Lions Forum)

[NewOrleansLion]

That was an appropriate end to the season - top 32. Hoggard was a major disappointment. I'd expect the offense to be more dynamic with Fears and Holloman running it.

On to football. I'm excited to see this reboot. I also find it easier to be a fan with Smith at the helm. I'd say Tucker rubbed me the wrong way, but he did that to himself.

[froot loops]

On the first game you saw all the hallmarks of an Izzo coached team in the tournament. A well prepared team freed from the shackles of Big Ten play that can steamroll a team with a similar talent level. In the second game we saw the hallmarks of an Izzo coached team has run up against frequently. When the talent level is not close, all the preparedness doesn't get you more than the first 10 minutes. The talent level of the Spartans has not been up to snuff really since that 2009 runner-up team. They have gotten to final fours on some magical runs since then, but it seems the ceiling is getting to the final four.

Izzo said he's going to get back to having a deep run or die trying. Unfortunately, he has been saying something similar for 4 seasons. This year he has openly complained about analytics and the transfer portal. I'm not sure how you can change being that stubborn. He's earned the right to try, but I'm not holding my breath

I attended State during Jud's final years. I lived across the hall from Respert and Pig Miller. Eric Snow was also lived in the dorm. Back then Izzo was already known as ball busting assistant that was powering the program even before Jud publicly annointed him successor. He was bringing in the talent. Jud delayed his retirement by one year and it hurt recruiting. I remember hearing from people who worked in the AD office that Izzo was upset about that. This last few years reminds me of those Jud years. I don't see a young dynamic Izzo type on the staff. It is kind of an old boy network that we saw with Dantonio at the end

[NewOrleansLion]

I don’t know anything about incoming freshmen, but Akins, Carr, Booker, Holloman, Fears…that’s a lot of talent.

I graduated in ‘89, but stayed in E.L. doing the long-haired rock band thing until ‘94, so it sounds like we had some crossover there, froot.

[froot loops]

How many of those players do you see playing in the NBA? I see Booker as an potential NBA talent, maybe Akins. The other guys might be eventually progress into a good college player by their senior year, but that won't be next year. It would be one thing if some of those guys were the main contributors and were coming back, but the two best guys this year were clearly Hall and Walker.

The team of 2000 that won the tournament had 4 NBA players (3 longtime) plus a couple stalwarts that played pro overseas for over a decade. I hope your right on those players, but I was unimpressed. They could be better if Tom Izzo uses the portal he hates to find players to augment those pieces. I think it's a necessity to use to compete nowadays.

[Mainevent]

Mainevent is getting treated to a huge upset in the making.

Hell yeah, great set of games in Pittsburgh. I don’t think I’ve ever experienced anything in person quite like those two Oakland games where the entire crowd was just so focused on a single player. The anticipation for the next Jack Gohlke shot was crazy. The build up of “ooohhhhh” as he came hard off a screen and the eruption if he hit the shot or the collective “awwwww” if he missed. True March Madness shit right there.

[NewOrleansLion]

Walker wasn’t noticeably better than last year. Hall improved, but he’s no star, either.

I think Coen Carr has the makeup of a guy who will take a huge jump next year. Akins will be key. He could be a superstar next year. If he takes that next step, and he supposedly has the work ethic to make that happen, they’ll be pretty damn good next year.

Main, I’d guess that has to go as one of the best sporting events you’ve ever attended. To witness a player to be in that kind of zone would be so cool.

[Mainevent]

Can we get Edey v Clingan in the championship game? It’s what we deserve.

[chemiclord]

Can we get Edey v Clingan in the championship game? It’s what we deserve.

What, refs choking on their whistles as the two murder each other on the court?

I loathe players like Edey and the bullshit he gets away with. "Oh, he's just so big and strong! It's so hard to officiate players like him!" Bullshit. It's perfectly easy to officiate players like him. CALL THE FUCKING CONTACT! If he's got someone in a fucking headlock, it's a FUCKING FOUL! If he runs someone over in the paint, IT'S A FUCKING FOUL!

It's only hard because the refs want it to be. They don't want to be booed because they whistled him three times in the half because he was flailing his arms like he's trying to flag down traffic after he drove his car into an overpass stanchion, and practicing for his fucking MMA career post college ball.

...

Can you tell I have thoughts on this?

[Mainevent]

Ah, you’re one of those . . .

[DanO]

What, refs choking on their whistles as the two murder each other on the court?

I loathe players like Edey and the bullshit he gets away with. "Oh, he's just so big and strong! It's so hard to officiate players like him!" Bullshit. It's perfectly easy to officiate players like him. CALL THE FUCKING CONTACT! If he's got someone in a fucking headlock, it's a FUCKING FOUL! If he runs someone over in the paint, IT'S A FUCKING FOUL!

It's only hard because the refs want it to be. They don't want to be booed because they whistled him three times in the half because he was flailing his arms like he's trying to flag down traffic after he drove his car into an overpass stanchion, and practicing for his fucking MMA career post college ball.

...

Can you tell I have thoughts on this?

LOL, It's not just Edey but I agree, Call it for everyone..

[chemiclord]

Ah, you’re one of those . . .

I'm one of those that thinks that if you actually called contact when it happens that'd solve a lot of supposed "problems" in the game, yes. A big part of the reason why flopping and embellishment happen is because refs aren't calling the contact they should be calling. It shouldn't fucking matter how hard you got hacked on the arm as you went up to shoot. The hack itself should be a foul. It shouldn't matter how hard you got pushed off your spot on the floor by an offensive player backing into you. Being pushed off your spot should be the foul.

And I'm not terribly sympathetic to the argument that "then there'd be a hundred fouls a game!" So be it. Players would figure it out quickly enough, and in the end you'd have a more free flowing game that would allow for skill to flourish.