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Originally posted by Jamie H
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I have no doubt it happened, and that it only made Carr even more angry at Miles. But at that point, the pair already were not exactly friends. They didn't like each other way back when they were both assistant coaches at Michigan. The other stuff certainly didn't help their animosity, but they never really got along all that much to begin with, as I understand it. -
Miles is a buffoon, UM is better off with Hoke.Atlanta, GAComment
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Miles is a buffoon that wins a ton of games. He's had tremendous seasons with mediocre QBs.
Long-term, U-M is probably better off with Hoke though.Last edited by Kstat; September 13, 2011, 05:18 PM.Comment
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I think the alleged campaigning at the golf outing is something that would extend beyond Lloyd. Stuff like that simply isn't done at MichiganComment
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Like I said, Hoke is a better fit for Michigan. Doesn't mean Miles isn't a great coach where he is.Comment
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If that had bothered the school they wouldn't have pursued him twice; at the most it was a forgivable offense.Originally posted by froot loops View Post
Now with that said, I suspect Miles is blacklisted now, as it's become clear that Miles merely accepted U-M's courting to squeeze a better deal out of LSU.Last edited by chemiclord; September 13, 2011, 06:30 PM.Comment
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If you think that, it makes Carr's "sabotage" greatly exagerrated. If he was using it to squeeze a better deal out of LSU, perhaps Lloyd was right.
I don't say that the outward campaigning necessarily bothered the school, but it bothered more than just Lloyd Carr. He didn't have to be a puppet master to sink that search. And the two pursuits looked a lot like they were putting on a show for the public. I have it on very good authority if Miles were ever truly offered the job he would have been on the next plane. Most likely the offer had a lot of strings attached.Comment
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If I felt that Carr was trying to deep-six the Miles hiring to save Michigan from itself, I'd be inclined to agree.
But my experience with the man was that he was doing it out of spite, because he was pissed that the school didn't want to hire his crony Ron English. Lloyd Carr is not a noble man, he's not the grumpy old grandfather with a heart of gold, no matter how much the media wants to paint him as such. He's a selfish, condescending, arrogant prick. He'd rather see Michigan go 3-9 with someone from his coaching tree than have success with someone who wasn't.
Perhaps it was the right action (I'd love to know exactly what the negotiations entailed, I've heard a shit ton of rumors but little confirmed), but it was done for entirely the wrong reasons. Carr didn't give a shit about Michigan failing with someone else (because he knew that it would give him another chance to push one of his guys); he simply didn't want it to succeed with Miles running the show.
And for the record, just because I know someone is going to accuse me of implying it otherwise; as far as I know, Carr had little to nothing to do with the Hoke hiring.Last edited by chemiclord; September 13, 2011, 08:20 PM.Comment
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Lloyd Carr is fiercely protective of his players, even when they fail him consistently, and even when it would be much more beneficial to him to let the kid that screwed up take the heat for a loss. I have a hard time believing someone like that is a bad guy that values himself over his program.Comment
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I think you will find it extremely rare for a college coach to throw his players under the bus. Hell, you don't even see it that often at the professional level. That's not exactly a unique trait. Hell, I'm trying to remember the last time Urban Meyer did that, and he'd throw his mother under a train if it got him a national title berth.Originally posted by Kstat View Post
But, hey, I'm sure Carr did fiercely defend his players... that is part of his job, really. That doesn't mean that he wasn't obsessed with his legacy, and would do anything to secure it, even if it meant hurting the program in the short term.Comment
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didn't watch the guy that succeeded Lloyd much, did you...RichRod abused the shit out of his guys, the QBs especially.
The new guy at Notre Dame is constantly on TV cussing his own players out on the sidelines.Comment
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In case you haven't noticed, RichRod was a catastrophe and a walking disaster of a person.Originally posted by Kstat View Post
As for Brian Kelly, there's a difference between yelling at your players for screwing up on the sidelines (and I'll have you know that Lloyd Carr did that as well), and blaming them after the fact for a loss or making the team look bad, which was what I thought you meant. Every coach has hollered at their players in the heat of the game, even your beloved idol Lloyd. I don't hold that against him, though... that's pretty much expected behavior, I would hope.Comment
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Doesn't matter if you win NicK Saban is the biggest hot head of them all on the sidelines. Here he is up 30-3 late in the game.The new guy at Notre Dame is constantly on TV cussing his own players out on the sidelines.
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Every coaches cusses out their players in the heat of the game from the sidelines. It happens. Some more than others, but they all do.
It's not a big deal. It's really kinda expected.Comment
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Brian Kelly is getting some heat for his behavior on the sidelines. Its a different case there at ND. It doesn't help that he isn't winning much and sent a video guy up when he shouldn't have during a practice last year. But if he were winning big they would tolerate it.
In my view cussing out players come with the territory, but if the coach only cusses out players and never comes to their defense or shows how much he cares, it hurts in the long run. From what I've heard, Saban changed after he left state in that regard. At State he was Nick Satan, he cussed out players, boosters, the coaching staff and was generally thought of as a miserable cuss.
The coach I work for is a grade A cusser but pretty much every player loves the guy by the end of their career. Because he's not always cussing them out. If you mention his name to old players, guys in their middle ages will tear up talking about him.Comment
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